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 New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)

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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Wed Aug 01, 2012 4:20 pm

Well Mafia is quite active lol, it really is a fun game. As well as ugh DOTA's so there are custom players out there. The 1.5 patch has been buggy as shit—I've had to reinstall the game twice now. My claim is there is one guy doing all the updates being that they're so frequent and last so long. Might be true who knows. I'll be looking forwards to the winter.
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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Wed Aug 01, 2012 4:33 pm

every major patch blizzard attempts to release ends with a lot of problems. By the time I start working again; editors will have found ways around various problems... Saving me time!

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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Thu Aug 02, 2012 9:02 am

http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/maps-564/custom-hero-arena-revolutions2-final-181986/index3.html

for wrath, and anyone else wanting the most recent version of the map. Hopefully we can get this here on a BGN bot and start playing with the skill changes.

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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Fri Aug 03, 2012 3:45 pm

I posted the map request of the newer edit here's the link. http://blinkgaming.net/forums/topic/12039-map-request-updated-cha/
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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Sun Aug 12, 2012 3:50 pm

Remade CHA pretty much. Managed to remove about 360,000 characters from the script; about 28% of the script size.

I also found and fixed a problem in my preloading system that may have been adding a lot of load time for players. It will need to be tested first; but I believe my optimizations should reduce loading times on faster computers by up to 10 seconds; and on slower computers by 30+ seconds.

Gonna do some work making the terrain pretty, when I get back in a week; then I would like to get some testing in; to make sure I didnt destroy the map while remaking it. I was testing solo; and it seems the basics all work; but, yeh know.. removing 28% of the map can occasionally cause problems.

Also; just a neat thing to point out...

The leveling system has been redone. that is the experience and levels, ect. I created an irritating formula for levels that makes them come a lot easier; and allows them to be endless.

Just some random numbers, in a roundabout way:
10,000 EXP should unlock all of the heroes for you
50,000 EXP will land you in the 60ish range.
100,000 EXP will put you around level 80 or so.
200,000 EXP will put you up around level 95.

Levels are endless; so here is the formula: Where L is level, and E is experience
L=E/(150+(E/100))

Example:
10,000/(150+(10,000/100) (that is 10,000/250)
L=40

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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Sun Aug 12, 2012 11:29 pm

so what will happen to us who are "max" level?
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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Mon Aug 13, 2012 4:19 pm

I think he set your experience at 1 million so a super high level that pretty much nobody would ever attain.
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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Mon Aug 13, 2012 8:23 pm

Indeed i think the points is he wont give codes for max level maybe for hero unlock for tourney wins or whatever.
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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Tue Aug 14, 2012 9:09 pm

I am allowing an option for past tourny winners; that they have have a code; with 30,000 EXP; or they may be auto-loaded; every game, with 30,000 EXP; but they will never be able to use the save/load feature (how it is right now for tourny winners)

Take your pick, and be online at a reasonable time that I can give you a code.

Also random; just for the sake of me crunching numbers for leveling balance; how much experience do you currently have saved?

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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Tue Aug 14, 2012 11:05 pm

ill take the perma code i guess. i dont want to/like to remember things...
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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Wed Aug 15, 2012 12:17 am

You know I never really checked there was a point where I thought um 40 was the max level but as soon as I realized 30 was I stop saving.

Edit: 177002
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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Wed Aug 15, 2012 6:27 am

I am going with the perma-code also; so much easier...

Careful, that is impressive. Level 30 was 125,000 exp. you would have made 34 or so, based on my old system. this one; I have to assume you would make somewhere around lvl 90.

I think it is like 250k or so to break level 100.

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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Sat Aug 18, 2012 10:13 pm

I'll take perma code, I never use save/load anyways.
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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Tue Sep 11, 2012 12:00 pm

I lost my lvl code :C
I remember I was 3 lvls away from The Bitch
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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Sun Nov 25, 2012 11:11 am

I will throw some general updates to the map up; so people know what is going on, and that progress is slowly being made.

For starters, the map script is a solid 40% smaller than it used to be. Despite running a lot more triggers during map load time (setting variables) and increasing doodads from ~1000 to ~4000, my load time has decreased by a few seconds.

I figured out what was causing a handful of desync issues, and fixed them. I am yet to have a problem since then. This includes the rag quest drop for part 1 and 2, and the 1st archon drop; along with a rare, rag kill drop.

The terrain has been polished quite well. very well. What I will gladly deem my most perfected terrain yet. I am looking for as much feedback on it as possible; as I would like to continue to hone my terraining skills. Something I am forever lacking.

Gladiator mode has been remade from scratch. While it is still the same general idea; it is written much better. Also, gold from rounds is higher, and increases with every round. We determined that a 12 round game will net you in ~210k (compared to the ~50k you would have netted in past versions). There are no gold from kills, and it is much more difficult to gain levels from killing other players. These changes are instituted to prevent a game from being too 1 sided, and to ensure balanced character progression in the later rounds.

Splash damage has been removed from all creep except for dragons. There were maybe 20 or so other creeps who dealt splash damage.

Dragons and harpy queens have been added to later levels of the game as well. Yes, there are now flying creeps all game. Flying creeps are a good deal weaker than ground creeps in later levels.

The "unsmooth" creep transition between 7 and 11 has been mellowed out. No longer will you fight a level 8 creep with 1800 HP, and later, a level 11 with 900 HP. For the most part, the level 8-10 creeps have been made much easier; while a few of the 10-13 creeps have been made more difficult. This change only took... how many years? +1 to auto attackers world wide!

Auto-kick has been removed entirely. There is an in game vote kick, and a bot vote kick. Now, it simply tells a player that they are being unproductive, and tells everyone in the game that said player is being unproductive. This may que people in to the idea that they should consider a vote kick.

Many of the bugs found with triggered skills, after the change,. have been fixed. After another week or so of closed testing, I will opt to put this on the bot.

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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Sun Nov 25, 2012 3:01 pm

Probably seems silly but how will this effect melee with feedback or no desire to pick up orbs? Whenever I get feed back on a melee my first thoughts are level 1-10 are going to annoying. Well a little off topic but my first real thought is should I hold off leveling feedback until I can afford poison so to stack both abilities. Just seems like having flying through out the entire game forces orb usage among melee. Also fire sword 1 doesn't hit flying.

Edit; Maybe it won't be that big of a deal so long as there are no flying immunes. God damn black dragons forcing me to buy orb of range ^_^
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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Sun Nov 25, 2012 4:33 pm

there are flying red dragons, which have 40% reduction. I think if you want to use feedback, your best choice would be to use the "dragon slayer" innate. it gives you the orb of range ability, and it also increases your attack damage.

The concept that it would be forcing players to pick that innate skills is also skewed, due to the wide variety of orbs available. It does force melee players to in some way be able to take down flying creeps. I am willing to undo this change if after testing, it is too damaging to melee, non spell casting classes.

With that in mind; I personally see this as a the negative side of the creep balancing level 8-10. Level 8-10 creeps were by far the hardest for auto attacking builds. Attacker vs spell caster, it is this area of the game where the most ground is usually lost for the auto attacker; as auto attacking builds do not normally come into their own until level 15+. Trading 1 bar for another, I guess.

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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Sun Nov 25, 2012 4:47 pm

By the way, is adrenaline rush supposed to cancel out orb effects while it is activated?
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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Sun Nov 25, 2012 4:54 pm

no. to my knowledge, it is simply frenzy, with a different icon. ***

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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Mon Nov 26, 2012 11:53 pm

As I'm thinking about it this change would hurt bombing pretty bad. As you know bombs do not hit air so bombing in general is reliant on getting a lot of luck on creep generation. What makes the Massive Bomb so effective is by the time you get it the only unlucky factor your facing is spell immuned units.
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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Tue Nov 27, 2012 4:41 am

massive bombs hit air ^^ though large do not. Hmm, I did not think of that side effect. Ponders Ponders...

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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:02 am

i need to add a formula to increase the XP gain if you random... some day...

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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Fri Dec 14, 2012 1:04 pm

Maybe... I think the current system could use a small nerf say no more then 1 level up point per game? I think a level 20 code should at least require 20 games. The good news is I'm seeing people load codes now.


random's need love let me find a song to be the national anthem

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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Fri Dec 14, 2012 1:25 pm

i think you would be hard pressed to get level 20 in fewer than 20 games. i guess if a random pub destroyed you; yeah. against a level 30 player, you might be able to jump from level 1-5. but even after that, there isnt much chance of more than a single level per game. your level 90+ is an extreme case. and even if you are losing a game against pubs; they need to kill you, not just your allies.

as I mentioned somewhere, I am hoping that players will be able to hover around level 30-40 without really being able to lose experience in a given game; but also without really gaining any unless they are decent. I might spread out the required levels for the special heroes, to entice players to level more. With the leveling system though; I feel as though level 100+ is going to be insanely hard to acquire and maintain. level 60 is going to be the general cut off for most players; due to getting tired of trying to gain points. I want the first 20 or so to be just a matter of playing the game.

Give it a week or two; and I can play with the formula; tell me what you see from the average public. I did just play a lvl 28 player who was terrible. just, terrible. but i see him a lot.

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PostSubject: Re: New edit of CHA (Need thoughts)   Sat Dec 15, 2012 1:34 pm

Well in one game I was able to gain 4,127 exp but that was a very unordinary circumstance. Opponent selected super start + 5 kills the game turned into a 1v1 due to disconnections. I random the build of beetles/water elementals/mana regen/critters and he afk a lot which led to making farming with beetles a breeze. Towards end game I had beetles farming creeps, the critters camping champion arena (with aid of me coming in and dropping immortal haste image) and me running through rag missions over and over.
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